<div class="moz-text-html" lang="x-western"><div>OE-TSC Minutes 12-May-2011</div><div><br></div><div>Attending: Richard, Koen, Khem, Tom, Mark, Stefan</div>
<div>Notes: Jefro</div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div>Agenda & Minutes</div><div><br></div><div><div> 01) Agree on meeting chair</div><div>stefan</div><div>___________________________________</div><div> 02) Status report on oe-core</div>
<div>RP__ has pushed the distroless changes</div><div>RP__ can make a post to oe-devel on behalf of the TSC? [general agreement]</div><div>RP__: Can we assume we trust me to write a suitable announcement? :) [yes]</div><div>
--> AR: (RP) write oe-core announcement for the masses</div><div>___________________________________</div><div> 03) Status report on pull model, contrib repo and guidelines</div><div>main discussion already on ML</div>
<div>___________________________________</div><div> 04) Status report on board support layer guidelines</div><div>coming from fray soon</div><div>___________________________________</div><div> 05) Status on layer splitting of metadata</div>
<div>merge with 02)</div><div>___________________________________</div><div> 06) Continue discussions on infrastructure items</div><div>RP
talked to the Linux Foundation today and I think we might be obtaining
some hardware in "weeks". Mike and Tom King are dealing with that</div>
<div>___________________________________</div><div> 07) Elections</div><div>waiting on board</div><div>___________________________________</div><div>08) RP is proposing that whilst the TSC has done good work on this and been</div>
<div>productive, we need to refocus and maybe spin off an interest group for</div><div>the OECore specific pieces and the original TSC focus needs to be</div><div>regained.</div><div><br></div><div>this TSC has operated very very differently to previous TSCs</div>
<div>continue as is or change</div><div>-->Koen to read up before next week</div><div>___________________________________</div><div>09) RP is also proposing that with the "distroless" configuration in place,</div>
<div>we're about ready to invite wider attention on OECore.</div><div>see #2 above</div><div>____________________________________</div><div>10) How should we (OE) handle non-Linux host support? Policies, priorities, etc.</div>
<div>fray: I bring this up because of the MacOS X work I did.. and now a few other people have started in on</div><div>RP: needs to be clean, not a maintenance headache</div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div>Raw Transcript</div>
<div><br></div><div>(21:00:19) ***RP__ is here</div><div>(21:00:29) Tartarus: That's a quorum then, yeah</div><div>(21:00:43) RP__: Yes, four of us</div><div>(21:01:09) stefan_schmidt: I can chair if people like</div>
<div>(21:01:25) Tartarus: works for me</div><div>(21:01:26) Tartarus: thanks</div><div>(21:01:27) RP__: stefan_schmidt: no objection</div><div>(21:01:49) RP__: Jefro did send out an agenda</div><div>(21:01:51) stefan_schmidt: ok, will bring up the agenda</div>
<div>(21:02:02) stefan_schmidt: yeah, will but it on pastebin just as reference</div><div>(21:02:08) stefan_schmidt: with fray item added</div><div>(21:03:03) stefan_schmidt: <a href="http://pastebin.com/jTL7wr3G">http://pastebin.com/jTL7wr3G</a></div>
<div>(21:03:18) stefan_schmidt: We start without jefro and someone just sends him the log?</div><div>(21:03:25) RP__: stefan_schmidt: I think so</div><div>(21:03:26) stefan_schmidt: btw, is someone logging? RP__ ?</div><div>
(21:03:27) fray: seems reasonable</div><div>(21:03:32) ***RP__ has logs</div><div>(21:03:46) RP__: stefan_schmidt: I posted some additions to the agenda too?</div><div>(21:03:56) stefan_schmidt: RP__: right</div><div>(21:04:05) stefan_schmidt: i will get an updated version up</div>
<div>(1:06:33 PM) stefan_schmidt: <a href="http://pastebin.com/hZBRq0mS">http://pastebin.com/hZBRq0mS</a></div><div>(1:06:38 PM) stefan_schmidt: There we go</div><div>(1:06:45 PM) stefan_schmidt: Agenda with the added items</div>
<div>(1:06:55 PM) Jefro: stefan_schmidt awesome, thanks</div><div>(1:06:59 PM) RP__: stefan_schmidt: thanks :)</div><div>(1:07:06 PM) RP__: Jefro: stefan_schmidt is chair today</div><div>(1:07:12 PM) fray: :)</div><div>(1:07:17 PM) stefan_schmidt: Jefro: we agreed on me being the meeting chair so far</div>
<div>(1:07:27 PM) Jefro: I gathered that. Stefan: congratulations</div><div>(1:07:36 PM) RP__: koen and khem send apologies</div><div>(1:08:11 PM) stefan_schmidt: so we are ready for take-off</div><div>(1:08:15 PM) RP__: stefan_schmidt: yes</div>
<div>(1:08:26 PM) ***stefan_schmidt stops his OE build to have better xchat performance :)</div><div>(1:08:54 PM) stefan_schmidt: 02) OE core status update</div><div>(1:09:18 PM) ***RP__ has pushed the distroless changes</div>
<div>(1:09:29 PM) stefan_schmidt: RP__: I think you and koen had some discussions about the gconf stuff</div><div>(1:09:44 PM) stefan_schmidt: raising points what should be in core and what in other layers</div><div>(1:09:54 PM) RP__: stefan_schmidt: We did as what koen asked for conflicted with what we'd agreed in previous tsc meetings</div>
<div>(1:10:04 PM) RP__: I think koen needs to be present for that discussion though</div><div>(1:10:07
PM) stefan_schmidt: RP__: thanks for the distro less stuff. Great in
time for the meeting and, hopefully, the announcement</div>
<div>(1:10:19 PM) RP__: and neither of us see it as a blocking issue on OECore, just needs discussion</div><div>(1:10:27 PM) stefan_schmidt: RP__: yeah, would make more sense</div><div>(1:11:02
PM) stefan_schmidt: RP__: I actually like to see such things coming up
from time to time to re-evaluate where to put things :)</div>
<div>(1:11:13 PM) fray: Assuming everyone is comfortable with the
existing changes, are we ready to formally announce it? (I know we have
more and more people using it every week -- which is really good)</div><div>(1:11:42 PM) stefan_schmidt: fray: I think so. We waited for distro less last week and RP__ got it ready in time</div>
<div>(1:11:45 PM) Tartarus: I think we must, yes</div><div>(1:11:52 PM) RP__: fray: I was getting to this and yes, I think we're about there for that</div><div>(1:12:08 PM) RP__: So the question really is who takes the action?</div>
<div>(1:12:24 PM) stefan_schmidt: nothing more to 02? Then we merge in 09 here</div><div>(1:12:24 PM) ***RP__ can make a post to oe-devel on behalf of the TSC?</div><div>(1:12:33 PM) stefan_schmidt: sounds good</div><div>
(1:12:45 PM) stefan_schmidt: I think it does reflect the TSC</div><div>(1:12:58 PM) RP__: Its what we minuted last week as our plan</div><div>(1:13:04 PM) stefan_schmidt: And we where set up to bring oe-core forward so it would be good to announce it as TSC</div>
<div>(1:13:17 PM) RP__: Since then we've ensured bitbake is more in sync and removed the final poky references</div><div>(1:13:31 PM) RP__: which were the things we wanted to do before announcing</div><div>(1:13:45 PM) stefan_schmidt: we are fine I would say</div>
<div>(1:13:54 PM) RP__: Can we assume we trust me to write a suitable announcement? :)</div><div>(1:14:10 PM) stefan_schmidt: I do :)</div><div>(1:14:39 PM) Tartarus: Yes, we do</div><div>(1:14:56 PM) RP__: stefan_schmidt: I'd take silence as acceptance ;-)</div>
<div>(1:15:06 PM) ***Jefro would hope so at this point</div><div>(1:15:12 PM) fray: no problem here..</div><div>(1:15:24 PM) stefan_schmidt: ok, all for it. RP__ please do it</div><div>(1:15:38 PM) stefan_schmidt: 09 done as well?</div>
<div>(1:15:39 PM) ***RP__ will aim to send something out tomorrow</div><div>(1:15:42 PM) RP__: stefan_schmidt: yes</div><div>(1:15:59 PM) stefan_schmidt: AR: (RP) write oe-core announcement for the masses</div><div>(1:16:07 PM) RP__: For 03), there has been some discussion about pull scripts and workflow</div>
<div>(1:16:21 PM) RP__: I'd suggest those discussions continue for all on the mailing list</div><div>(1:16:32 PM) stefan_schmidt: agreed</div><div>(1:16:40 PM) Tartarus: agreed</div><div>(1:16:44 PM) fray: the discussion has been growing, and I think is headed in the right direction -- agreed</div>
<div>(1:16:49 PM) stefan_schmidt: khem did finish his AR regarding the commit scripts</div><div>(1:17:03 PM) fray: the 5th version of the commit/patch message guidelines was just posted..</div><div>(1:17:11 PM) fray: this is close to the final version -- assuming no major comments</div>
<div>(1:17:11 PM) RP__: stefan_schmidt: yes, we have commit emails now so Tartarus should be happy</div><div>(1:17:35 PM) Tartarus: yes</div><div>(1:17:52
PM) fray: just one thing to mention.. Paul Menzel has made a number of
editorial comments and improvements in the guidelines as we've gone..</div>
<div>(1:18:01 PM) stefan_schmidt: so fray has an eye on commit
guidelines and Tartarus, khem, Daren, etc will keep discussing the pull
scripts</div><div>(1:18:18 PM) stefan_schmidt: fray: thats good</div><div>(1:19:34
PM) ***stefan_schmidt just notes that oe-core gets other distros even
before the announcement.(<pb_> in other news, though, I nearly
have some semblance of a working micro layer on top of oe-core.)</div>
<div>(1:19:57 PM) RP__: great :)</div><div>(1:20:01 PM) stefan_schmidt: 03 needs no more discussion here?</div><div>(1:20:10 PM) stefan_schmidt: Seems the current main topics are on the ml</div><div>(1:20:16 PM) RP__: stefan_schmidt: agreed</div>
<div>(1:20:27 PM) stefan_schmidt: 4) Status report on board support layer guidelines</div><div>(1:21:02 PM) stefan_schmidt: has this moved?</div><div>(1:21:22 PM) ***RP__ doesn't know</div><div>(1:21:57 PM) stefan_schmidt: anyone has updates on this?</div>
<div>(1:21:59 PM) Jefro: I have an action item there to send fray a rough document</div><div>(1:22:01 PM) Khem__ [d0dfd0f2@gateway/web/freenode/ip.208.223.208.242] entered the room.</div><div>(1:22:08 PM) Jefro: by the end of this week - on target</div>
<div>(1:22:16 PM) fray: yup, so I think were slightly behind on that.. but nothing big</div><div>(1:22:31 PM) stefan_schmidt: ok</div><div>(1:22:48 PM) stefan_schmidt: so this AR just stays and you come back next week</div>
<div>(1:22:52 PM) stefan_schmidt: hi Khem__</div><div>(1:23:08 PM) fray: stefan_schmidt yup</div><div>(1:23:14 PM) stefan_schmidt: ok</div><div>(1:23:23 PM) stefan_schmidt: 05) Status on layer splitting of metadata</div>
<div>
(1:23:45 PM) Khem__: Hi</div><div>(1:23:56 PM) Jefro: question that has bugged me for a couple of weeks on 05 - why is it different from 02?</div><div>(1:24:01 PM) Jefro: (hi Khem__)</div><div>(1:24:09 PM) Khem__: Just sneaking in on an iPad</div>
<div>(1:24:18 PM) fray: originally it was seperate working being done both related to 02 and the existing oe repository..</div><div>(1:24:27 PM) stefan_schmidt: Khem__: with OE on it of course ;)</div><div>(1:24:41
PM) fray: I've take it to mean (now that "02" oe-core is down) that it
refers to moving and modifying things from the existing OE repository..</div>
<div>(1:24:59 PM) stefan_schmidt: Jefro: 02 was more about general oe-core problems</div><div>(1:25:06 PM) fray: -if- everyone is in agreement thats what it means, then we should likely re-word the topic</div><div>(1:25:12 PM) fray: (or remove it if it's no longer an issue)</div>
<div>(1:25:20 PM) stefan_schmidt: Its just that some of the important problems are actually around layers :)</div><div>(1:25:27 PM) RP__: Well, I think Koen's concerns fall under this</div><div>(1:25:32 PM) RP__: (topic)</div>
<div>(1:25:43 PM) RP__: but we can defer that to next week or the mailing list</div><div>(1:25:50
PM) Jefro: ok, thakns. I was just wondering whether 02 and 05 can be
merged at this point, particularly after RP announces oe-core to the
list, or whether they should stay separate. Now leaning toward the
latter, but will do what you guys want.</div>
<div>(1:25:55 PM) RP__: I'm not aware of any other issues</div><div>(1:26:00 PM) fray: yes.. I think we need to keep an open item about layer "issues" brought up on the mailing list or elsewhere..</div><div>
(1:26:16 PM) fray: (either content of the layer, way layer is being used, etc..)</div><div>(1:26:28 PM) fray: RP__, I'm not aware of anything else yet..</div><div>(1:27:02
PM) RP__: For 6), I talked to the Linux Foundation today and I think we
might be obtaining some hardware in "weeks". Mike and Tom King are
dealing with that</div>
<div>(1:27:36 PM) stefan_schmidt: Good</div><div>(1:27:43 PM) stefan_schmidt: so Tom is already involved</div><div>(1:28:03 PM) RP__: yes</div><div>(1:28:11 PM) Khem__: is this hardware for general oe use</div><div>(1:28:25 PM) RP__: Khem__: It will be for OE to decide how best to use it, yes</div>
<div>(1:28:33 PM) Khem__: Ok</div><div>(1:29:05 PM) stefan_schmidt: That leaves 07, 08 and 10 open</div><div>(1:29:18 PM) stefan_schmidt: elections now or as last item?</div><div>(1:29:19 PM) ***Khem__ thinks iPad is not that iBad</div>
<div>(1:29:27 PM) ***Jefro suggests elections as last item</div><div>(1:29:35 PM) Jefro: Khem__ is it iRad ?</div><div>(1:29:44 PM) stefan_schmidt: Khem__: well a fancy device just for IRC ;)</div><div>(1:29:46 PM) RP__: Well, elections is easy, we're waiting on the board</div>
<div>(1:29:56 PM) RP__: and its kind of related to 08</div><div>(1:29:59 PM) fray: AFAIK, the board is in control over that</div><div>(1:30:04 PM) RP__: right</div><div>(1:30:17 PM) RP__: So let me talk a little about this topic</div>
<div>(1:30:20 PM) stefan_schmidt: voting system tests went well it seems</div><div>(1:30:26 PM) RP__: agreed, yes</div><div>(1:30:35 PM) RP__: I'm not sure how many people saw the discussion I had after the TSC meeting last week</div>
<div>(1:30:47 PM) ***stefan_schmidt not</div><div>(1:30:49 PM) RP__: I raised the issue of non-voting TSC members</div><div>(1:31:01 PM) stefan_schmidt: ah, you mean on the ml</div><div>(1:31:02 PM) RP__: It was shot down with good reason but I think it was right to ask some questions</div>
<div>(1:31:09 PM) RP__: yes, on the ml</div><div>(1:31:29 PM) RP__: It made me realise how this TSC has operated very very differently to previous TSCs</div><div>(1:31:53
PM) RP__: If you look at the agenda we're very focused on a specific
topic and we're functioning more like an interest group</div>
<div>(1:31:53 PM) Khem__: Yes</div><div>(1:32:11 PM) stefan_schmidt: hmm</div><div>(1:32:12 PM) fray: I'd certainly agree with that</div><div>(1:32:14 PM) RP__: The original idea of the TSC was a decision breaker, not a discussion forum as we've been doing</div>
<div>(1:32:21 PM) Khem__: That was the mandate to start with</div><div>(1:32:22 PM) stefan_schmidt: you mean like an oe-core IG</div><div>(1:32:26 PM) RP__: yes</div><div>(1:32:42 PM) RP__: So my question is whether its time to rethink what we're doing and where and how we're doing it</div>
<div>(1:32:45 PM) stefan_schmidt: thats because we have been setup for exatcly this task</div><div>(1:32:53 PM) Khem__: I thing technical roadmap</div><div>(1:33:01 PM) RP__: stefan_schmidt: I know, but I think now is the time to review it</div>
<div>(1:33:04 PM) Khem__: Is also what ya should be involved in</div><div>(1:33:20 PM) RP__: ya?</div><div>(1:33:25
PM) fray: The more I think about it.. the more I think an oe-core IG
makes sense.. I see the TSC as the group who sets direction -- and gets
things off the ground.. but eventually the work should migrate... (with
the e.V. and users taking over...)</div>
<div>(1:33:25 PM) Tartarus: So, I wouldn't object to making the TSC go
back to the old "decider" role, so long as we propose an open weekly IG
type meeting</div><div>(1:33:27 PM) Khem__: Typo</div><div>(1:33:46 PM)
Tartarus: Since yeah, it's really good to get as many of the folks that
care popping in, focusing on issues and otherwise being social</div>
<div>(1:33:55 PM) fray: Would the IG allow non e.V. to participate?</div><div>(1:33:58 PM) RP__: I think what this group has been doing it useful and I don't want to change that</div><div>(1:34:15 PM) RP__: but I think a more open meeting and detactment from the TSC might now be a good idea</div>
<div>(1:34:28 PM) stefan_schmidt: fray: I think IGs should be based on technical interest and merrits not on ev membership status</div><div>(1:34:50 PM) stefan_schmidt: fray: thats only for stuff we need to vote on because we failed to get it done without :)</div>
<div>(1:35:06 PM) Tartarus: Maybe I should correct myself, I don't mean IG in the formal sense</div><div>(1:35:07 PM) RP__: So two questions, do we create an IG for this subject and is it open?</div><div>(1:35:07 PM) Khem__: I think unless oe is released with. Oe-core we need to keep functioning this way a bit as well</div>
<div>(1:35:17 PM) Tartarus: I just mean a time where folks that care and have opinions can come in</div><div>(1:35:18 PM) fray: stefan_schmidt thats my thinking as well..</div><div>(1:35:25 PM) RP__: Tartarus: right</div>
<div>(1:35:25 PM) stefan_schmidt: RP__: Subject == oe-core?</div><div>(1:35:28 PM) RP__: stefan_schmidt: yes</div><div>(1:35:33 PM) Tartarus: And there's a set of topics and it's not a free for all</div><div>(1:35:38 PM) stefan_schmidt: RP__: I would like to see this yes.</div>
<div>(1:35:53 PM) RP__: I think it would need an agenda and someone driving it, maybe a TSC member</div><div>(1:35:53 PM) stefan_schmidt: Like there is kind of an IG for infrastructure already</div><div>(1:36:02 PM) Khem__: Until next oe release we need to be working the way we have a bit</div>
<div>(1:36:06 PM) stefan_schmidt: with people from OE and yocto</div><div>(1:36:10
PM) fray: the key for the success or failure of a switch to oe-core, is
that it needs to be actively maintained by a core of folks until it has
enough users (and maintainers) to continue to drive it..</div>
<div>(1:36:21 PM) fray: TSC fills that role today.. IG can easily do so tomorrow</div><div>(1:36:43 PM) RP__: The TSC needs to also covering what it used to be covering</div><div>(1:37:00 PM) fray: yup</div><div>(1:37:04 PM) RP__: Er, The TSC needs to get back to also covering what it used to be covering</div>
<div>(1:37:04 PM) Khem__: Besides yocto their are handful of folks using oe-core though it's increasing</div><div>(1:37:27 PM) Khem__: Yes I agree</div><div>(1:38:20 PM) RP__: I put this on the agenda as I really want people to start thinking about it</div>
<div>(1:38:34 PM) RP__: Perhaps we do so and come back to it next week?</div><div>(1:38:45 PM) stefan_schmidt: I was just about to propose this :)</div><div>(1:38:56 PM) fray: think thats a good idea</div><div>(1:38:57 PM) stefan_schmidt: I need to think more about it and a week would help me with it</div>
<div>(1:39:03 PM) Khem__: I think we should have an item to discuss weekly activity if anything needs discussion</div><div>(1:39:09 PM) ***RP__ tries to do longer term planning as well as short and medium :)</div><div>(1:39:52 PM) stefan_schmidt: Khem__: hmm, we could gather some of the status items under the weekly activity item</div>
<div>(1:40:12 PM) Khem__: Yes week in perspective</div><div>(1:40:58 PM)
fray: ya, thats likely the right topic.. we can each mention anything
we know of thats happened in the last week or so..</div><div>(1:41:02 PM) ***Jefro jefro notes new perpetual agenda item</div>
<div>(1:41:11 PM) stefan_schmidt: Lets try if we can make such an item next week</div><div>(1:41:18 PM) Jefro: we can call it "weekly world news"</div><div>(1:41:52 PM) stefan_schmidt: for TSC and IGs people should think about it this week</div>
<div>(1:42:28 PM) Khem__: Discussions on layering tools is important going forward</div><div>(1:42:50 PM) RP__: There are people working on layer tooling</div><div>(1:43:04 PM) RP__: based on the f2f discussions we had along with mailing list feedback</div>
<div>(1:43:13 PM) stefan_schmidt: RP__: will there be an interim status update?</div><div>(1:43:40
PM) stefan_schmidt: RP__: Would be good to have an early version before
to much works goes into it to give feedback and maybe direction</div>
<div>(1:43:46 PM) RP__: stefan_schmidt: Its being done in stages, I'd expect to see patches at each step</div><div>(1:43:49 PM) stefan_schmidt: I guess you are directly involved?</div><div>(1:43:58 PM) RP__: stefan_schmidt: the plans are on the wiki</div>
<div>(1:44:04 PM) stefan_schmidt: RP__: ok, good. Is there a repo for it?</div><div>(1:44:08 PM) RP__: stefan_schmidt: please do comment on the mailing list if you have feedback</div><div>(1:44:15 PM) RP__: stefan_schmidt: no, there is no code</div>
<div>(1:44:23 PM) RP__: stefan_schmidt: hence rfcs as soon as there is some code</div><div>(1:44:27 PM) stefan_schmidt: RP__: ok, so early still ;)</div><div>(1:44:31 PM) RP__: stefan_schmidt: yes</div><div>(1:44:39 PM) stefan_schmidt: nv then I wait for some patches :)</div>
<div>(1:44:39 PM) Khem__: Cool thx</div><div>(1:44:41 PM) RP__: stefan_schmidt: bluelightning is leading it btw</div><div>(1:44:48 PM) RP__: so talk to him if you want specifics</div><div>(1:44:57 PM) stefan_schmidt: thanks</div>
<div>(1:45:13 PM) stefan_schmidt: That means we only have 10 left</div><div>(1:45:19 PM) stefan_schmidt: 10) How should we (OE) handle non-Linux host support? Policies, priorities, etc.</div><div>(1:45:33 PM) stefan_schmidt: fray: You have only Unix in mind or also Windows systems?</div>
<div>(1:45:39 PM) fray: I bring this up because of the MacOS X work I did.. and now a few other people have started in on..</div><div>(1:45:40 PM) ***RP__ commented on this on irc which was that it depends how hacky and invasive the patches are</div>
<div>(1:45:48 PM) Khem__: An IG will be good for it</div><div>(1:45:53 PM) stefan_schmidt: heh</div><div>(1:45:58 PM) fray: but it's not specifix to MacOS X.. it could easily be BSD or even something like Windows (cygwin?)</div>
<div>(1:45:59 PM) stefan_schmidt: our first IG born ;)</div><div>(1:46:06
PM) RP__: I'm fine with collecting up the changes and merging anything
that isn't going to be a major maintenance headache</div><div>(1:46:17 PM) RP__: please don't do windows</div>
<div>(1:46:18 PM) fray: what (as the TSC) do we expect for these? what limitations are made on this tupe of changes..</div><div>(1:46:25 PM) stefan_schmidt: but I agree with khem. Kergoroth and Koen did also work for MacOSX</div>
<div>(1:46:27 PM) Tartarus: So long as it's clean</div><div>(1:46:29 PM) Tartarus: I don't think we care</div><div>(1:46:41 PM) RP__: It *needs* to be clean and not a maintenance headache</div><div>(1:46:41 PM) stefan_schmidt: and with other unix systems coming in the patches should get less hacky as well</div>
<div>(1:46:42 PM) fray: my concern would be things like do we require
filesystems that are case sensative? or will we accept changes to make
case not an issue..</div><div>(1:46:45 PM) Tartarus: And clean means the "ugly" hack for something in OSX or Cygwin is isolated at least</div>
<div>(1:46:45 PM) fray: (just an example)</div><div>(1:47:20 PM) Tartarus: If it's all handled in conf/osx.conf and doesn't make other things have 50 variables, it's fine</div><div>(1:47:22
PM) fray: thats the thing, I expect a few hacks here and there.. but
what I'm not clear on is what will be acceptable.. (and perhaps the
answer is simply on a case-by-case basis we make that call)</div>
<div>(1:47:28 PM) stefan_schmidt: fray: I think non case sensetive fs would be to much of a hassle</div><div>(1:47:34 PM) RP__: fray: I think it has to be case by case</div><div>(1:47:53 PM) stefan_schmidt: its just to deep into all kind of packages ...</div>
<div>(1:47:59 PM) Khem__: Fray in general case sensitive ness sometimes is coming from package arcs too e.g. Makefile makefile</div><div>(1:48:12 PM) RP__: and yes, a non case sensitive file system might be potentially too nasty</div>
<div>(1:48:18 PM) fray: yup.. just mentioning it as an issue I know will come up</div><div>(1:48:31 PM) Tartarus: Khem__: OT, do you see my msg?</div><div>(1:49:21
PM) stefan_schmidt: fray: gather some people around it, prepare a
contrib repo for the nasty stuff, think about cleaner solutions and
bring this forward piece by piece</div>
<div>(1:49:35 PM) fray: so anyway, I wasn't looking for a direct
answer.. just want to make sure when these issues pop up, as a TSC we
can give direction.. and right now direction is not to overly burden
maintenance on our core Linux hosts -- and it needs to be "reasonable"..
reasonable defined per patch/change</div>
<div>(1:49:48 PM) fray: stefan_schmidt yup.. thats what I was thinking as well..</div><div>(1:49:54 PM) stefan_schmidt: Personally I think windows is not worth the effort as vmare or such is easy enough for them</div><div>
(1:50:14 PM) fray: stefan_schmidt agreed.. I think BSD and MacOS X are more likely.. but....</div><div>(1:50:18 PM) RP__: and likely has better performance ;-)</div><div>(1:50:26 PM) stefan_schmidt: RP__: heh</div><div>(1:50:39 PM) stefan_schmidt: fray: I think we can take them just as all other patches</div>
<div>(1:50:57 PM) fray: (on a tangent, you'd be surprised at how many
folks won't allow vmware in their corporate environments.. and similarly
won't allow Linux because it's no a support OS..)</div><div>(1:51:01 PM) Khem__: I would be interested in bad</div>
<div>(1:51:06 PM) Khem__: Errr bad</div><div>(1:51:10 PM) Jefro: LOL</div><div>(1:51:14 PM) fray: (luckily thats changing.. but it's reality that may cause someone to try to do native windows support..)</div><div>(1:51:16 PM) Khem__: Spell checker</div>
<div>(1:51:18 PM) fray: (that someone is NOT me)</div><div>(1:51:34 PM) stefan_schmidt: fray: well, then he really will have a hard time</div><div>(1:51:34 PM) Jefro: fray do you find that cygwin is similarly disallowed?</div>
<div>(1:52:01 PM) fray: Jefro, cygwin -- for the purposes of build
system emulation -- could be made to work, but is so incredibly painful,
it's unlike to be worth it..</div><div>(1:52:11 PM) stefan_schmidt:
fray: I don't mind repos where patches for such nasty things are shared,
but those people should be aware that such things can and will break
quite often</div>
<div>(1:52:22 PM) fray: (I doubt significant changes to oe would be necessary to support cygwin...)</div><div>(1:52:50 PM) Khem__: Yeah</div><div>(1:53:03 PM) Khem__: It's solaris or BSD</div><div>(1:53:06 PM) Khem__: Yay</div>
<div>(1:53:12 PM) fray: well hopefully solaris is dead.. ;)</div><div>(1:53:23 PM) fray: that just leaves BSD(s), and MacOS X</div><div>(1:53:23 PM) fray: ;)</div><div>(1:53:41 PM) fray: anyway, thats all I wanted..</div>
<div>(1:54:07 PM) Khem__: BSD and macs with ports might converge the changes needed</div><div>(1:54:26 PM) stefan_schmidt: Khem__: and his BSD world around him in this company building ;)</div><div>(1:54:58 PM) Khem__: Yes I might get nod on some work on it</div>
<div>(1:55:10 PM) stefan_schmidt: so we all agree that patches for this will by case-by-case just as all other patches as well</div><div>(1:55:35 PM) Khem__: Yes</div><div>(1:55:44
PM) stefan_schmidt: we don't see urgent support for other systems as
linux but would welcome them if the patches are able to integrate it in a
sane manner</div>
<div>(1:55:47 PM) fray: seems reasonable to me</div><div>(1:56:32 PM) stefan_schmidt: good</div><div>(1:56:43 PM) stefan_schmidt: I think that's it for the meeting today then</div><div>(1:56:47 PM) Tartarus: Yes</div>
<div>(1:57:09 PM) Jefro: awesome</div><div>(1:57:12 PM) RP__: Can we minute that Koen has an action to read the discussion on agenda item 08 in preparation for next week</div><div><br></div><br>-- <br>Jeff Osier-Mixon <a href="http://jefro.net/blog" target="_blank">http://jefro.net/blog</a><div>
Yocto Project Community Manager @Intel <a href="http://yoctoproject.org/" target="_blank">http://yoctoproject.org</a></div><br>
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